Bullseye ThinFire instead of kilm wash on metal molds - WarmGlass.com

Bullseye ThinFire instead of kilm wash on metal molds

This is the main board for discussing general techniques, tools, and processes for fusing, slumping, and related kiln-forming activities.

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Marie Duncan
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Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 6:39 pm

Bullseye ThinFire instead of kilm wash on metal molds

Postby Marie Duncan » Tue Sep 30, 2003 6:53 pm

:) I am completely new at this. Just finished reading Brad Walker book. It is great. Want to share with anyone interested that I have had good results in using a piece of ThinFire between glass and stainless steel molds. This makes it possible to use these molds for draping without using kilnwash. Which I find to be a big pain. Just cut the ThinFire slightly larger than the piece of glass.

Marie

charlie
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Postby charlie » Tue Sep 30, 2003 7:01 pm

draping means outside? that's what your supposed to do with steel molds. or do you mean inside the form? does the paper fold up and leave marks on the glass?

Marie Duncan
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Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 6:39 pm

ThinFire on metal molds

Postby Marie Duncan » Wed Oct 01, 2003 2:16 am

Yes I mean on the outside of mold. ThinFire is a light weight shelf paper and it replaces the need for a kilm wash on the metal mold. I find it time consumming and difficult to get kilm wash to stick to the metal and this is a very quick and satisfactory solution. I have not seen anything mentioned in articles or have not found anyone else that has tried this method.

Marie

jim simmons
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Postby jim simmons » Wed Oct 01, 2003 5:11 am

charlie wrote:draping means outside? that's what your supposed to do with steel molds. or do you mean inside the form? does the paper fold up and leave marks on the glass?


works just fine. No marks that I can see.

Jim

Marie Duncan
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Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 6:39 pm

Postby Marie Duncan » Wed Oct 01, 2003 1:50 pm

Sorry Charlie I didn't answer your question regarding the surface. It is very similar to kilm wash. No problem with folding. The paper appears to adhere to glass and follows through the melt. Washes off with warm water.

I have used S/S cheapie bowls purchased at grocery store. One is about 4 in dia. and the other about 8 in. Work great. Also used short former, but my problem with this is not related to the paper. I have a problem catching before it melts too far and is not attractive. Got any suggestions?

Marie
Washington State

charlie
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Postby charlie » Wed Oct 01, 2003 1:56 pm

Marie Duncan wrote:Sorry Charlie I didn't answer your question regarding the surface. It is very similar to kilm wash. No problem with folding. The paper appears to adhere to glass and follows through the melt. Washes off with warm water.

I have used S/S cheapie bowls purchased at grocery store. One is about 4 in dia. and the other about 8 in. Work great. Also used short former, but my problem with this is not related to the paper. I have a problem catching before it melts too far and is not attractive. Got any suggestions?

Marie
Washington State


thanks. i have some bowls i got at goodwill that have really steep sides. i've used them for small things so that the glass only hits the bottom and a little on the sides.

catch it sooner? :)

you have to look more often. a lower temp for longer will do the same as a higher temp for shorter. lower your top temp and it won't move as fast. you also have to learn how much below your top temp to stop it as the kiln will hold a lot of heat and only go down slowly (for a brick kiln), or use crash cooling to get it below 1100 or so so make it stop moving when you want it to.

Kaye
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Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2003 5:33 pm
Location: Camano Island, WA

Postby Kaye » Wed Oct 01, 2003 5:16 pm

Thanks, Marie. I've wondered about using thinfire over a mold, but haven't been brave enough to try it!

Kaye

Lia Howe
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Location: Haliburton, Ontario

Kiln-forming discussion

Postby Lia Howe » Wed Oct 01, 2003 9:49 pm

I always use kiln wash on my stainless with no problems. Mix it with methyl hydrate instead of water. I looks like a thin coat on the stainless. After you have covered all the surfaces you set the methyl hydrate om fire. *****Make sure all containers of methyl hydrate are closed and put away before you burn the mold.*******
After the flame , which is invisible, burns off you will see the kiln wash. I have never had a problem. Works great for me. It's quick, easy, and I get to play with fire.Lia

SAReed
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Location: NorCal

Re: Kiln-forming discussion

Postby SAReed » Sun Oct 05, 2003 8:46 pm

Lia Howe wrote:I always use kiln wash on my stainless with no problems. Mix it with methyl hydrate instead of water. I looks like a thin coat on the stainless. After you have covered all the surfaces you set the methyl hydrate om fire. *****Make sure all containers of methyl hydrate are closed and put away before you burn the mold.*******
After the flame , which is invisible, burns off you will see the kiln wash. I have never had a problem. Works great for me. It's quick, easy, and I get to play with fire.Lia


Sounds like fun! But I almost burned down my kitchen steaming vegetables...maybe I shouldn't try it. :doubt:
Stacey

PDXBarbara
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Location: Portland, OR

Postby PDXBarbara » Sun Oct 05, 2003 9:11 pm

ooo. love the setting on fire technique.. (hey is there anyone on THIS board who wouldn't love it??)

So, 1) is mythyl hydrate some kind of alcohol?
2) Does the wash/methyl hydrate mix adhere to the SS without heating? Is it sticky or something??

chemistreeeeflunkeeeeegirl.
Barbara Bader

Lia Howe
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Location: Haliburton, Ontario

Postby Lia Howe » Mon Oct 06, 2003 10:35 am

Methyl Hydrate is an alcohol based product,for those of us who live in colder climates it is closly related to gasline antifreeze.
When mixed with kiln wash (I use Bullseye) it lookes like thin milk. No you don't need to heat the mold to get it to stick. As you brush on the mixture it will pool at the base of the mold. Just make sure that ALL surfaces are covered with a thin coating of the wash. it will look like you have not put much on but when you fire (as in flame) the surface you will see a great coating of kiln wash.Lia

PDXBarbara
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Postby PDXBarbara » Mon Oct 06, 2003 12:15 pm

Thanks, Lia... 1 more question...
when you burn it... fumes toxic?
BB
Barbara Bader

Brad Walker
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Postby Brad Walker » Mon Oct 06, 2003 1:22 pm

PDXBarbara (Bader) wrote:Thanks, Lia... 1 more question...
when you burn it... fumes toxic?
BB


Methyl hydrate is also know as methanol or wood alcohol. It's highly flammable, and (according to the MSDS) "toxic by inhalation, ingestion, or skin absorption." If you use it, then by all means take the proper safety precautions.

http://ptcl.chem.ox.ac.uk/MSDS/ME/methyl_alcohol.html

http://www.2spi.com/catalog/msds/msds02523.html

charlie
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Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2003 3:08 pm

Postby charlie » Mon Oct 06, 2003 1:26 pm

i wonder if cheap brandy would be a good substitute? :)

Lia Howe
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Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2003 1:36 pm
Location: Haliburton, Ontario

Postby Lia Howe » Mon Oct 06, 2003 4:22 pm

Cheap Brandy is better for hot toddys. You know warm milk and brandy. My father gave it to me as a baby to help with teething. I know, that can explain sooooo much about me now.
Oh Ya to answer your questions. YES YES YESS!!!!! Safety,Safety and lots of common sense is needed in the studio. Methly Hdrate is a toxic substance. BEFORE you use it learn all you can about how to handle this liquid SAFELY!!!LIA

LDGlass
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Location: Milwaukee, WI
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Postby LDGlass » Tue Oct 07, 2003 11:55 pm

I've used thinfire over a bracelet mold and it worked fine -- no marks. :D

Laura


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