Steve, double irid haze thingy - WarmGlass.com

Steve, double irid haze thingy

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Ron Coleman
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Steve, double irid haze thingy

Postby Ron Coleman » Wed Mar 12, 2003 11:59 pm

Just wondering if you found out anything else about the haze problem and the double irid?

I fired a double irid piece last night and it turned out crystal clear. I blasted off the irid with 120 grit aluminum oxide grit, 80 psi, washed with soap and water and a green 3m pad. Firing cycle was 120 min to 1000 f, 30 min to 1225 f. 90 min soak, 45 min to 1450 f, 35 min soak, cool and anneal. This was a 15 inch plate.

Ron

Steve Immerman
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Postby Steve Immerman » Thu Mar 13, 2003 9:36 am

Ron,

No. I haven't figured it out yet. However, so far, everyone that has responded to me that they have successfully used this technique has been using aluminum oxide. Tony has indicated that the gave up on this technique because of the same problems I'm having - he's using silicon carbide.

So far, my unproven theory is that the silicon carbide grit fractures the surface of glass differently than aluminum oxide - and that makes some sort of difference when refired. I also see this when I blast and firepolish certain colors of glass.

I just ordered a box of aluminum oxide grit 120- and I'll put this theory to rest as soon as it comes. I'll then be the proud owner of three boxes of grit!

If I still have a problem, then I'll be at a total loss as to what variable I'm missing. If the haze disappears - then we'll have to revise what we tell people about the two grits being interchangeable.

I'll let you know what I find out.

Steve

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ps. If this link doesn't work today, sorry. I'm having some web server problems. sci

Ron Coleman
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Postby Ron Coleman » Thu Mar 13, 2003 9:53 am

Steve

The bowl looks great, a real CLASSY piece. :wink:

Ron

Tony Smith
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Postby Tony Smith » Thu Mar 13, 2003 9:55 am

What a beautiful job on the horse bowl Steve.

Please let us know how the Aluminum Oxide works for the irid on irid technique so we can all add it to our encyclopedia of useful information.

Tony
The tightrope between being strange and being creative is too narrow to walk without occasionally landing on both sides..." Scott Berkun

Steve Immerman
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Postby Steve Immerman » Thu Mar 13, 2003 10:03 am

Thanks guys. It's sure nice to have moral support when dealing with these technical issues.

Steve

Brock
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Postby Brock » Thu Mar 13, 2003 10:43 am

I can tell you right now, emphatically, that AlOx works perfectly for the double irid process, I've been doing it for 20 years. I'm really living in fear because I'm in the midst of making my Pilchuck Auction piece, and
I blasted it with SiC. I won't be able to post any results until my metals arrive, but during our teaching we've had problems every time we've used SiC for this process. Brock

Bob
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Postby Bob » Thu Mar 13, 2003 10:44 am

Steve,

I noticed you said you had three "boxes" of grit. I was wondering if you were getting your grit through a specialty shop such a s a lapidary store ( that is where I got abrasives in small boxes for a vibralap ). I buy my abrasive for sandblasting through a sandblast supply store I found in the yellow pages. It was substantially cheaper that buying by the box. I don't know if I am incorrectly interpreting your comment... I've been know to jump the gun in the past.

Cheers

Bob

Steve Immerman
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Postby Steve Immerman » Thu Mar 13, 2003 10:55 am

Bob,

I got my first two 50 lb "boxes" of grit from Glastar. They cost about $100 each.

I just ordered 50 lbs of aluminum oxide from McMaster Carr for about $50.00.

If the Aluminum works better than the silicon, I'll have 100lbs of silicone carbide for sale.........

Steve

Bob
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Postby Bob » Thu Mar 13, 2003 11:10 am

Steve Immerman wrote:Bob,

I got my first two 50 lb "boxes" of grit from Glastar. They cost about $100 each.

I just ordered 50 lbs of aluminum oxide from McMaster Carr for about $50.00.

If the Aluminum works better than the silicon, I'll have 100lbs of silicone carbide for sale.........

Steve


Hi again Steve,

Sounds about right for pricing. I recently got 2bags@ 55lb of 220 grit Al2O3 from a company called Manus for a total of $80Can... yes Canadian! It seems that once your material or equipment is not intentionally sold for hobby use the price drops substantially.

Al2O3 works fine for me but I just use it for getting as matte finmish prior to slumping. I haven't taken anything back up to full fuse.

Cheers

Bob

Cynthia

Postby Cynthia » Thu Mar 13, 2003 5:11 pm

Bob wrote:
Al2O3 works fine for me but I just use it for getting as matte finmish prior to slumping. I haven't taken anything back up to full fuse.

Cheers

Bob


I have been blasting for that matte finish too using silicon carbide. I was told that I had to clean it like a mad woman, scrubby, scrubby, rinse, rinse, before firing it again.

Can you tell me what the benefits or pros and cons of Al203 (which is what exactly? - aluminum doodleide? (Chemisty challenged girl)) vs. silicon carbide? I am currently borrowing a blaster, but am seriosly considering adding one to my studio. Would like to know a bit about the abrasives and why you would chose one over another.

Thanks

Bob
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Postby Bob » Thu Mar 13, 2003 5:36 pm

Cynthia Oliver wrote:
Bob wrote:
Al2O3 works fine for me but I just use it for getting as matte finmish prior to slumping. I haven't taken anything back up to full fuse.

Cheers

Bob


I have been blasting for that matte finish too using silicon carbide. I was told that I had to clean it like a mad woman, scrubby, scrubby, rinse, rinse, before firing it again.

Can you tell me what the benefits or pros and cons of Al203 (which is what exactly? - aluminum doodleide? (Chemisty challenged girl)) vs. silicon carbide? I am currently borrowing a blaster, but am seriosly considering adding one to my studio. Would like to know a bit about the abrasives and why you would chose one over another.

Thanks


Hi Cynthia,

Well now I am out of my depth. When in doubt tell the truth. Al203 is alumina oxide... I believe. I use it because of a post by Steve Klein about a year ago. Ho said that he uses 220 grit alumina oxide to get his incredible satin finish. If it is good enough for Steve it is more than adequate for me. That was all the thought and research I put into it.
No kidding.

Cheers

Bob

Brian and Jenny Blanthorn
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Postby Brian and Jenny Blanthorn » Thu Mar 13, 2003 5:43 pm

I use 280 silicon carbide on my bowls then fire polish

Well I used 2 till I became peb boy

But I do have a venturi extraction system

Image

That should B vortex extraction

I was wondering wether the problen is the silica on the blasting haze

As its possible the irid is a layer of stuff including silicon

n the silicon is pushing the irid in2 the glass rather than abrading it

Well at least a bit of it

Might B wrong but odd that alumina seams OK

Image
Last edited by Brian and Jenny Blanthorn on Fri Mar 14, 2003 5:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
Image

Tony Smith
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Postby Tony Smith » Thu Mar 13, 2003 8:53 pm

As far as blasting for the matte finish, I use silicon carbide and get excellent results. I rinse the piece under running water and have never scrubbed a piece to get it clean. It is true that I don't use the irid on irid technique because I haven't been able to get rid of the haze... much like Steve's experience. But with two cabinets full of silicon carbide, I'm not about to discard it for Al2O3 which is guaranteed to give me a permanent twitch after all the shocks I'll get from it here in the dry winter air.

Tony

Image
The tightrope between being strange and being creative is too narrow to walk without occasionally landing on both sides..." Scott Berkun

Don Burt
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Postby Don Burt » Thu Mar 13, 2003 11:21 pm

Ron Coleman wrote:Steve

The bowl looks great, a real CLASSY piece. :wink:

Ron


Its a great piece, but you have to admit selling Ron on a black and red piece is a no-brainer.

Steve Immerman
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Postby Steve Immerman » Thu Mar 13, 2003 11:50 pm

Tony Smith wrote:What a beautiful job on the horse bowl Steve.

Please let us know how the Aluminum Oxide works for the irid on irid technique so we can all add it to our encyclopedia of useful information.

Tony


Tony,

The new grit came today. Emptied the old grit, and filled with 120 Aluminum Oxide, and blasted some test pieces. In the kiln now.

I should have an answer by tomorrow am..........

Steve

Mike Byers
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Postby Mike Byers » Fri Mar 14, 2003 12:14 am

I've used silicon carbide for a number of years and have noticed that careful cleaning is necessary because it's very easy to leave a slight silicon carbide residue on a piece that you think is clean. This is even true with clear float glass. I first discovered this when I lit a "clean" piece of carved 1/2" float with neon: the amount of silicon carbide still on the glass was a real surprise! Cleaning the piece under running water works well for me, too, and I use a soft bristle brush (like a toothbrush) to go over the etched or carved areas while water is flowing across the glass. This seems to do the job just fine.


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