Vote on board format - Page 3 - WarmGlass.com

Vote on board format

This is the main board for discussing general techniques, tools, and processes for fusing, slumping, and related kiln-forming activities.

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Should the board change back to the old format?

Yes.
50
23%
No.
116
54%
It doesn't matter to me.
28
13%
I'm not familiar with the old format.
19
9%
 
Total votes: 213

Brad Walker
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Postby Brad Walker » Wed May 21, 2003 1:01 pm

It seems to me we have two distinct camps, one which feels that the old board was better and one that likes the new board. It seems that many of the old, longer term visitors like the old board best, while many of the newer posters like the new format. According to the poll, the new format seems to be preferred to the old by 2 to 1.

I'm at a loss as to what to do. I don't want to alienate old users, nor do I want to ignore the results of the poll. I guess I could just have two boards, one in each format. Or maybe there's a board format someone's aware of that marries both types.

I'm wide open to suggestion.

Brad Walker
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Postby Brad Walker » Wed May 21, 2003 1:05 pm

A couple of additional comments on the new board vs. the old.

The level of posts from the old board to the new is relatively unchanged.
The number of newbie posts, as well as the number of not-a-full-name posts, is also relatively unchanged. I don't think the level of discussion is changed significant either -- both boards had their share of good information and inane conversations both.

I think that some of the discussion and concern from old-timers stems from a desire to return to the days when the board community was much smaller and everyone knew everyone else. I don't think that's possible, though of course it could be done with lots of different boards.

What I do know for sure is that this bulletin board has been a major focus of my life over the past few years, and I'd love to find a middle ground that satisfies everyone. I'm just not sure that one exists.

Barbara Muth
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Postby Barbara Muth » Wed May 21, 2003 1:13 pm

Brad Walker wrote:It seems to me we have two distinct camps, one which feels that the old board was better and one that likes the new board. It seems that many of the old, longer term visitors like the old board best, while many of the newer posters like the new format. According to the poll, the new format seems to be preferred to the old by 2 to 1.

I'm at a loss as to what to do. I don't want to alienate old users, nor do I want to ignore the results of the poll. I guess I could just have two boards, one in each format. Or maybe there's a board format someone's aware of that marries both types.

I'm wide open to suggestion.


Brad, even if I like the old format better I would hate to see you set up two separate boards.

barbara
Barbara
Check out the glass manufacturer's recommended firing schedules...
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Geri Comstock
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Postby Geri Comstock » Wed May 21, 2003 1:39 pm

Brad -

Much as I prefer the old board format, I think that you should do what's best/easiest for you. You devote countless hours to this endeavor and have made a huge difference in the warm glass community with your efforts.

You're the one who has the most invested in terms of time and effort for maintaining the board. Do what's best for you.

Thank you for providing us with this forum. It's made a big difference in my fusing life and I'm sure many of the other old timers would say the same. I've made some wonderful friends through this board and learned alot.

With much gratitude -

Geri

PDXBarbara
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Postby PDXBarbara » Wed May 21, 2003 1:56 pm

Brad Walker wrote:It seems to me we have two distinct camps, one which feels that the old board was better and one that likes the new board. It seems that many of the old, longer term visitors like the old board best, while many of the newer posters like the new format. According to the poll, the new format seems to be preferred to the old by 2 to 1.

I'm at a loss as to what to do. I don't want to alienate old users, nor do I want to ignore the results of the poll. I guess I could just have two boards, one in each format. Or maybe there's a board format someone's aware of that marries both types.

I'm wide open to suggestion.


Hi Brad... I'm glad we're all talking about this, no matter what the result. The main thing is, of course, is that we HAVE the board... whatever the format.
About the poll.... I question its usefullness as a true indicator. Only about 120 folks have clicked yay or nay on the poll... out of how many registered? About 800 or somesuch? Also, a lot of people have slipped off the map because a) they couldn't navigate the new board (people reached frustration overload...we all have various degrees of know-how with these infernal machines) or b) they just check it out less & less often since the change. (I'm an example of the latter... I hadn't checked in about 2-3 weeks! & then I saw the thread started by Els called "Kvetch" which was a discussion of old board/new board. By the way.. can't find that thread ANYWHERE now... maybe I'm not up-to-speed on the SEARCH function yet?).
But I'm just grateful for the board, whatever its format. As for the logistics of the old board, I'm a little confused by some folks' problems with it. It offered a series of ways to view the posts... in other words, there was something for everyone on the list. Is it possible, Brad, that some people weren't aware of those options or how to use them? Just a thought...
Aside from logistics, I'm also not sure why people prefer the segmentation that comes along with the new format. It leads to separation in so many ways. I find value in the insights & info from folks doing work totally different from mine... the entire universe of kilnforming & kilnformers is what we're about, even when someone's asking a narrow question that is just about business or just about fusing or just about etc. etc. etc. Suggestions for new forums keep popping up... Here's what I say (stuttering over my tongue ramming my cheek) "United we stand, divided we bore."
For what it's worth my .02 and humbly hopin' this helps & thanks to Brad no matter which way it goes.
xxoo,
Barbara
Barbara Bader

charlie
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Postby charlie » Wed May 21, 2003 1:57 pm

i'm confused about this whole issue. imho, i think people are confusing the medium and the contents. if you have something to say, then say it. if people are not finding it, then perhaps the tool is deficient, but the medium isn't forcing people into commenting less, changing their thoughts, or otherwise affecting what people are stating.

the board is only a tool; albeit perhaps an imperfect one. you deal with the imperfections and carry on notwithstanding them. if you truly want to communicate, you'd use smoke signals if necessary.

is there a better tool? i don't know, not having investigated other ones nor their administration. since i'm not the one administering nor paying for this, i don't feel that i have any vote in the matter. i'll use the tools provided and make do. i don't think i could have learned any more easier than following this board in all it's incarnations, but the format doesn't really have anything to do with the contents.

Brad Walker
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Postby Brad Walker » Wed May 21, 2003 2:29 pm

PDXBarbara (Bader) wrote:I saw the thread started by Els called "Kvetch" which was a discussion of old board/new board. By the way.. can't find that thread ANYWHERE now... maybe I'm not up-to-speed on the SEARCH function yet?).


I deleted the thread. It had deteriorated into a pissing contest between two of our board regulars.

Having to delete occasional threads has unfortunately occurred with both the old and the new boards. You'll have to blame the censorship on me, not on the software.

PDXBarbara
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Postby PDXBarbara » Wed May 21, 2003 3:22 pm

Brad Walker wrote:
PDXBarbara (Bader) wrote:I saw the thread started by Els called "Kvetch" which was a discussion of old board/new board. By the way.. can't find that thread ANYWHERE now... maybe I'm not up-to-speed on the SEARCH function yet?).


I deleted the thread. It had deteriorated into a pissing contest between two of our board regulars.

Having to delete occasional threads has unfortunately occurred with both the old and the new boards. You'll have to blame the censorship on me, not on the software.


OH DARN! I missed out on all the piss!
BB
Barbara Bader

Barbara Muth
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Postby Barbara Muth » Wed May 21, 2003 6:06 pm

PDXBarbara (Bader) wrote:OH DARN! I missed out on all the piss!
BB


Barb it's usually pretty stinky....
Barbara

Check out the glass manufacturer's recommended firing schedules...

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Mark Selleck
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Postby Mark Selleck » Thu May 22, 2003 12:30 am

Brad, I found the old format to be much easier/quicker to go through. A quick scroll down the page allowed me to skip threads I had no interest in, and it was easy to find new comments on older threads. I find myself not visiting the current forum as often since the change, just because of the time it takes me to go through it. But, as others have said, whatever is easier for you. It's a great resource, whatever the format.

David Williams

Postby David Williams » Thu May 22, 2003 4:37 pm

Doug wrote:What Ron said, David said, part of what Cynthia said, Barbara said, Mary Kay said....and what PDX Barbara said........The old board was much easier in format to use, and in a much more personable, friendlier fashion. And maybe I'm wrong, but more professional dialogue at times. .....Doug


Hey Doug, what happened to your Maui trip? You know some tourist punched out that gallery owner a couple months ago. He's extrordinarily hard to deal with. Someone actually wrote to the local paper soon after saying he deserved it. About what everyone said obviously there's a clear consensus that if you're going to agree with me its best to post a disclaimer first. I sure can't argue with that.

Ps. I'm sorry to hear about any thread being deleted. I think the censorship is far more offensive than any opinion you're likely to hear on a glass board.

Doug
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Postby Doug » Fri May 23, 2003 12:36 am

Well David, the Maui trips been moved ahead on the schedule 2x's now. I'll certainly let you know when Its certain and will write and plan a get together for sure. Its that damn work, alway seems to get in the way. Just had a old Kona friend email me the same ? today.
I'll bet that guy was Fred's brother that owns/runs the main gallery in town. Fred has always been kind, honest and cheerful with me, but Ive heard that his bro is a real asshole. (uh oh...I hear the delete button coming) hahah
Concerning the censering. Maybe I'm gotten a little overwhelmed lately with all the censership happening on such a large scale across our country (abet, through out the world) by this current facist administration, to really be in tune to respond to any of these small scale annoyances, but like has been said before....Its not a democracy. This board I mean...hahah. Maybe I'm becoming one of them....baaaaah!
Actually this polling post has morphed into a crossbreed between a spab post and the "real thing post", so really, it should be eliminated at once...just on those grounds.

dee
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Re: Vote on board format

Postby dee » Fri May 23, 2003 10:24 am

Brad Walker wrote:I have received several requests to return to the old board format.

Please take a moment to register your vote on this topic.

Thanks.


brad, the new board is quite nice, makes it easier to find things, has a slew of great new features to play with if one so desires. this bb sw really makes it easier to read all the posts and browse the topics. and the different topic areas now are great.

just my $.02 and yes i voted...
D
Dee Janssen
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Erik Brown

Postby Erik Brown » Fri May 23, 2003 12:15 pm

Geri Comstock >>> ...snip...

I didn't quote your post because the quote feature of the new board inevitably sends my poor old Mac into hyperspace from which it can't return. I don't know if other people aren't using it for that reason or if they don't understand it yet.

...snip... <<< Geri Comstock

How old is your Mac, what version of the O.S. are you using, and what version of Netscape are you using? I have a Performa that I don't use anymore. The monitor is on its way out, so that wouldn't be so useful, but if you think the Performa would be a step up, you are welcome to it. What applications are you tied to? Perhaps a new GNU/Linux box would be a good alternative...

And, I edit the quoted text in order to reduce redundant clutter in the thread. If I have a response to one part of a lengthy post, repeating the entire post wastes space. And if there is a picture in the post, that's even worse. Scrolling down a page with the same large picture embedded more and more deeply in quote boxes because people aren't editing the quotes becomes a drag.

Erik

David Williams

Postby David Williams » Fri May 23, 2003 5:37 pm

Sounds like I'll be in portland before you're in the islands. My grammpa Brownie has his 90th birthday on july 17 so we're going to try and do it without missing a show. That's alot of plane fare for only ten days though. Right now I'm writing to you on my laptop from my palacial suite here at the Maui Islander Lahaina. We're on the third day of the six day international festival of canoes which means Dena is getting hoarse, my son's eyes are bleeding from the chlorine and I'm ready for my second half-rack of Steinlager. About lunchtime I'll be buzzed enough to go help deal with the tourists. Life is good man.

Doug
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Postby Doug » Fri May 23, 2003 7:12 pm

Mahalo David.......Sounds Sweet! You guys have lots of fun and maybe I'll hook up with ya this time around when you come into town...You still have my ph #...just email if you dont. We'll get together and have a few real Pac.NW beers and talk smack. Looks like Island time may be later this summer or even late fall as my schedule is filling up for the year. Can't turn down any work with this horrible economy looming......Life is good here too. 82degrees and its finally turned spring.....Later

Sara
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Postby Sara » Fri May 23, 2003 7:36 pm

PDXBarbara (Bader) wrote:ANYWHERE now... maybe I'm not up-to-speed on the SEARCH function yet?) Here's what I say (stuttering over my tongue ramming my cheek) "United we stand, divided we bore."
For what it's worth my .02 and humbly hopin' this helps & thanks to Brad no matter which way it goes.
xxoo,
Barbara


I agree with Cynthia, David, Brock, Mary Kay, Barbara, Geri et al. At first I didn't care and maybe would have voted that way and then realized I found myself wandering off into new realms.

Trying to be an old dog learning a new trix and thunking I'm sorta computer savy I've found the new format way too impersonal . . . it's all bells and whistles. I've tried and tried to adapt.

As an insight I don't like flash or roll-overs or mini movies on websites, although would have loved to have read the censored thread to bring some umph back. I'm a censorship be damned sorta girl.

Sometimes change is good and sometimes its simply change.

My quarters worth.

Sara

JimV
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Stick with it

Postby JimV » Fri May 23, 2003 10:19 pm

I didn't see the real issue - that the software for the old board style is less than effective - resulting in significantly increased workload on the board operator.

Now I personally HATE this software, on any board I've seen it on.

But it works... and what is more important than my petty little snit is that we must work with that which will postpone Board Manager Burnout as long as possible. And it is far from the worst implementation of the software, too.

I don't vote for the new system because I like it - I vote my pragmatism. And I stopped whining on the other boards for the same reason.

And one more thanks for the work you do. It shows, even if we don't say it too often.

Jim V

Paul

Postby Paul » Fri May 23, 2003 11:58 pm

I went to Maui to see these guys..and I would have paid good money to see both of them get a kickin'...they are the worst gallery operators I have ever dealt with anywhere in the World. They have no problem with screwing the artist at every opportunity.

David Williams

Postby David Williams » Sat May 24, 2003 3:47 pm

Paul wrote:I went to Maui to see these guys..and I would have paid good money to see both of them get a kickin'...they are the worst gallery operators I have ever dealt with anywhere in the World. They have no problem with screwing the artist at every opportunity.


Really! And they jerk the customers around too if they don't look qualified. (How they can tell I have no idea. Lots of old hippies around who look homeless but have very deep pockets) Hence the asskicking. He claimed he wouldn't sue the tourist because the tourist was a family man but the truth was he started it, just bit off more than he could chew. They have this feature in the "maui time" magazine where people can print anonymous commentary; someone wrote in that they witnessed the whole thing and had seen the guys' activity for years and couldn't think of a person more deserving of a lickin. There's tons of other stories floating around Lahaina about the guy.

Hey the invitation is still open for you too mate if you get over here again. Sorry to take the thread so offt rack.


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