Hot clothes

[PDXBarbara]

I have a top loading kiln. It's awful when I need to do stuff inside the kiln when it's at temp. I've some of the lovely silver attire, a face shield (which I dislike because it's hard to really see properly with it on, so I tend to peer out the bottom).

So while I was at GAS in June, I back-ordered some of the protective clothing from Gott. They have this nifty material that's very protective but feels like a nice soft sweater. In other words, don't feel like the Tin Man... like I do in the silver clothes.

I bought 1 Gott sleeve, and this item they call something like the Ice-T... it's a cotton shell with a band of this protective sweater-like material across the chest...(yep, designed by women, for women...).

These clothes are aimed primarily at furnace workers... but they may be good for kilnfolk too... like me... who like to get their fingers hot while keeping the flesh, if you know what I mean. Combing is nearly impossible for me at this time... I'm thinking these clothes may help me do that sort of thing more often.

Anyway, I received my clothes last week, and wore them recently when I opened up at 1700 for a look-see. All was well across the chest, but below that, the cotton part was hot & ready to smoke.

Alan Gott tells me, via email, that they're selling full-frontal tees & aprons, but they're selling tees, aprons, & shell/tanktops in a range of $100 - $150 (U.S. bucks) retail.

I know I can minimize my smokin' clothes dilemma by rigging a hoist to the lid so I can stand back a bit & not get the tropical blast.

But wondering how others on the board would juggle the two "ouch" factors here: "Ouch" my bank account's injured... vs... "Ouch" my stomach's a-sizzling...
Barbara
xxoo
BB

[Ross]

I was curious about the face shield

http://www.labsafety.com/store/product_ ... ent_id=632

Has anyone used it and is it worth the money?

[Greg Rawls]

Couple of things to think about -

1) Hate to tell you this, but your best best is aluminized kevlar or aluminized leather (the silver stuff). It reflects heat better than anything else and molten glass will not stick to it. This is known as primary protective clothing and is designed to prevent burns.

2) Most other types of protective clothing are secondary protective which means their purpose is to prevent clothing fires, not burns. These are things like kevlar. Your best bet for inexpensive secondary FR clothing is 100% wool at least 20 ounce. It is naturally flame resistant. It will not prevent burns, but will self-extinguish if ignited. Make sure the wool is not blended with a synthetic!

3) Cotton is lousy - if ignited it will keep flaming.

4) Synthetics are the worse. Not only do they have low melting points, they will melt to the skin with sufficient heat. This includes polar fleece.

I am Safety & Health Manager for a really big aluminum company and we use wool/viscose blend for our folks with minimal molten metal exposures and aluminized kevlar, wool or leather for close exposure to molten metal. Sorry I ran on and hope this helps!

[Tom White]

Ross, the face shield pictured in the link you provided looks like the one I purchased from Jim Schell a few years ago. I like it very much because it allows me to see both inside and outside of the kiln at the same time. I own several shades of welders safety glasses in gren tints but they darken things outside the kiln to the point that I too tend to look under them instead of through them. With the face shield I can see everything around me and feel absolutely no heat from the kiln on my face when I wear it.

Best wishes,
Tom in Texas

[Terry Craig]

allan's stuff rocks (and he's a great guy too) i use his steamers in the hot shop and wear his new sleaves in there, as well as using them when i do kiln work. i love the stuff and plan on buying a shirt for both the kiln room and the hot shop. it is so much more comffy than my old kevlar stuff, that once i felt how soft this stuff was and how well it keeps the heat back i was hooked. i wrapped my hand in this stuff and held it 4" from the open door of my furnace and felt no heat for almost a minute this stuff rocks!

terry craig
studio tech.
mississauga living arts centre
mississauga, ont

[Ross]

Is there a way to contact of Alan?

[Terry Craig]

yes allan Gott 403 256 6079
or check out his web site at http://www.northernheat.ca
hope this helps
terry craig

[Allan Gott]

Thanks Terry.....the new material is special stuff.

Barb is using a design that is intended for furnace glassmakers. The Ice-T tank top has the band of protection where our customers told us to put it, across the chest. The rest of the garment is cotton, that's all we need.

Kiln and torch work require different designs. Question is Barb, were you able to extend your working time with the lid open because your arm and some tender parts were not burning? If so, all of your clothing was being exposed to more heat than usual and any cotton would react the same way.

What Greg fails to mention is the heat storage characteristics of aluminized clothing and all of the kevlar/nomex products available until now. There is no reflection without absorption, however small, and at glass temperatures, it's considerable. The fabric we're using IS designed to prevent burns AND penetration of molten materials, and it breathes, releasing any stored energy in a matter of seconds.

We are doing a website update with the new products which should be complete in a few days. Stay tuned.

Allan

[PDXBarbara]

Question is Barb, were you able to extend your working time with the lid open because your arm and some tender parts were not burning? If so, all of your clothing was being exposed to more heat than usual and any cotton would react the same way.
Allan

Yes, Allan... that might be what happened. I wore no other protective gear except the ice-t and one "ice" sleeve (and regular hot gloves of course) and one regular "silver" sleeve. So only my arm and my boobs were really covered with the protective material. Typically I use the silver clothes to cover up as much as possible... 2 sleeves, and an apron which I actually tie around my neck like a bib... (pretty hilarious looking... it was the best I could get at the local distributor .... I bought it cause I needed it at the last minute.) This works best if I also wear more heavy clothing underneath... leather or something. So, with the Allan's "ice" stuff... which is REALLY comfy, I think I could do w/out all the extra stuff. Unfortunately, I can't afford to buy full front designs they're offering now, because I got excited at GAS & got the Ice T that protects only the chest. C'est la vie. The material's wonderful though. It feels soft & pliable... can't tell the difference between it and a regular sweater.
BB

[Rika Hawes]

I have some of Allan and Anne's protective gear as well and I agree that it's the best stuff I've seen for keeping cool.

I do a lot of sand casting and I always felt rather awkward in leather, Kevlar or silver stuff.
I started wearing my lumber jacket (I am assuming this isn't just a Canadian thing). It's thick (Icouldn't tell you exactly what it's made of right now since it's at the studio) and I'm pretty sure it's cotton. They're plaid jackets, without a liner. They're really warm in the winter, but they're also very cool in the studio. I haven't been burned yet!
Rika

[Laurie Young]

This may be a totaly ridiculous idea, but I took a "felting" class last weekend and made myself a "felt" piece that I am going to turn into my blowing arm protector. Its pure merino wool, soft as anything, but thick and matted. The process is easy, its cheap and fun to do and you can have wonderful colours as well... Ill have to let you know how it works

[Nikki ONeill]

Laurie:
What a great idea! Please share some details on sewing your own sleeves. I'd like to make arm protection, at least, for reaching in the kiln to add frit to cones during casting. Raku tongs help to keep some distance but it's still too hot.
BTW: we saw a lot of sheep on the drive from Melbourne to the Grampians along the Great Western Highway. Is the soft merano wool from a special variety of sheep?
Nikki

[Laurie Young]

Hi Nickki,
I am going to use velcoro to fasten mine- so I can adjust as I get hot and sweaty, but you can sew felt just lke you can material. You can make it any thickness also, the one I made is three layers, but I am going to try about 5-6 (provided this works). Merino are a special breed of sheep, they have what is classed to be some of the finest wool, lots of lanolin or something (people go to school for years to become wool classers). I have no idea whether this will work, but Im blowing on friday so Ill let you know

[Allan Gott]

I wish you all the luck with your experiment.

We have just published our website update with all of the protective garment info.

http://www.northernheat.ca

[Terry Craig]

lanolin is very flamable! STRAIGHT WOOL IS A BAAAD IDEA.
TERRY

[Laurie Young]

thanks Terry, I didnt know that. We have all been using sleeves cut off of pure wool jumpers for blowing , which is what we were told to do, unless we could get the kevlar sleeve. I didnt know if felt would work, it just seemed like such a soft thick alternative. I certainly dont want to set my arm on fire!

[Laurie Young]

Just a last word, I used the felt sleeve to blow yesterday, and it worked very well, probably not appropriate for kiln protection, but it was fantastic for what I wanted- very flexible and heat retardant. My instructor says to use natural fiber, hence the wool or cotton, synthetics will melt into you if on fire. The felt doesnt seem to be particularly flamable, I cut a bit off and burned it, but it was fairly resistant. Ive used velvro to attach so if it was a problem I could get out of it pretty quickly.

[Allan Gott]

"The felt doesn't seem to be particularily flamable"..........I guess it depends how particular you are. You are risking burns of the second degree - that means permanent scarring. How fast do you think you can get a moist, burning sleeve off if someone accidentally hits your arm with a torch and the sleeve ignites with all that nice lanolin in it?

Your instructor is partly right, "synthetics" do melt. That's a pretty broad statement, synthetic what?It's also misinformation along the lines of "sunglasses are sufficient protection for working in a gloryhole", ask Mike at auralens about that one. Thanks teach for telling me it's OK to wear glasses that cause my retinas to open even further to allow that nice UV radiation to burn the crap out of them.

Our fabric is specifically designed to NOT MELT.

Same old same old. Take a chance, do it cheap......or......buy the best - ie. CORRECT high quality solution, buy it once, work in safety and comfort for the duration.

[Laurie Young]

I guess what I meant was it didnt burst into flames when I held a flame under it, but you are right, it would be a different story if I hit it with a torch or hot glass. Ive wacked myself with the jacks a few times so am pretty careful. I have a kevlar sleeve on order, but they are a bit scarce around here- I realize they are a better option, but was making do in the meantime. And got a little overexcited about the softness and flexibility. Sorry if I was steering anyone down a wrong path- didnt mean to do so.

[Tony Smith]

Thanks teach for telling me it's OK to wear glasses that cause my retinas to open even further to allow that nice UV radiation to burn the crap out of them.

Allan, that's a point well made with a couple minor corrections... there's minimal UV light emitted from a glory hole. It's mostly white light and a lot of infrared light which may have a long term effect on the corneas, not the retinas.

While it may seem like a picky point, a person can wear regular safety glasses and block almost 100% of the UV light. Glasses that block UV light do nothing for someone looking into a glory hole. Welder's glasses rated IR1.7 and above block more than 95% of the infrared light. They also reduce the intensity of white light to the point where the pupils can manage the light level and reduce the chance of damaging the retinas.

Tony