Tack Fusing on Irid Surface

RobinE · Post by **RobinE** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 11:50 am

Does anyone regularly or semi-regularly tack fuse onto an irid surface? Is there a chance that the tack fused pieces will "pop" off at a later date? Out of a grouping of 2 dozen plates/trays, while slump firing, I had one tack fused piece (dichroic noodle) split then pop off. I realize that the area of a noodle is small indeed so that might be a factor. I've fixed it now and would love any thoughts/solutions.

Thanks in advance.

RobinE

Brock · Post by **Brock** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 11:53 am

I've had beads, (again, a very small surface area) pop off. Can you dremel. or otherwise remove some of the coating so that you have a glass to glass contact? Brock

RobinE · Post by **RobinE** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 11:56 am

My thoughts exactly Brock. I don't have a dremel tool and I was thinking that I could use some etching cream to remove a bit of the irid. Your thoughts? Thanks for your help.

Brock · Post by **Brock** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 11:59 am

I don't think etching cream removes irid. Brock

RobinE · Post by **RobinE** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 8:17 pm

I had a blonde moment that has now passed (I hope), Brock.

I have an etching/engraving tool in my studio bag of tricks. I'll use that to remove some of the irid coating, then tack fuse the noodles.

Glass to Glass contact it is.

Thank you

RobinE

Tony Smith · Post by **Tony Smith** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 11:32 pm

The etching cream will remove some of the irids. I've had luck removing the Spectrum and the Uroboros Irid (although I've had some feedback that the Uro Irid doesn't always etch off). The Bullseye irid is the toughest and etching cream won't even touch it.

Tony

RobinE · Post by **RobinE** » Sun Jan 18, 2004 10:44 am

Thanks for passing on specifics on what irids the etching cream works on, Tony.

I'll try the etching cream on some Spectrum irid. Bullseye irids are what I am using for this series with dichroic noodles, so I'll use my etching tool.

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Sun Jan 18, 2004 11:02 am

Hi Robin,

I have worked with tack fused beads on irid surfaces and had some popping off. Some of it was caused by trying to tack fuse irid on irid.... just didn't work. When only one surface is irid it seemed to work OK if I took the temp to 1345F (hotter than I regularly tack fuse (1325)) and soaked it for 30 minutes. Perhaps the small mass of the beads makes it difficult to bond onto the surface.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,

Bob

RobinE · Post by **RobinE** » Sun Jan 18, 2004 11:24 am

Thanks, Bob

I've been taking the tack fuse for dichroic noodles to irid to 1350, soak 10 minutes. I will try your suggestion of 1345 for 30 and see if that works.

Cheers backatcha

judith · Post by **judith** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 8:29 am

Robin,

Another easy way to get bettter adherence is to use a bit of clear powder between the design element and the irid surface. Just coat the back of the design element with a bit of GlasTac (or something similar) and dip it into clear powder. Then place it, powder side down, on the irid surface and fire. The powder will melt quickly and invisibly and fuse the surfaces together.

judith

Duane Sitton · Post by **Duane Sitton** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 9:58 am

judith wrote:Robin,

Another easy way to get bettter adherence is to use a bit of clear powder between the design element and the irid surface. Just coat the back of the design element with a bit of GlasTac (or something similar) and dip it into clear powder. Then place it, powder side down, on the irid surface and fire. The powder will melt quickly and invisibly and fuse the surfaces together.

judith

I've been using the clear powder for some time too, it also seems to help fusing dichro frit to dichro.

An added benifit of the clear powder on the jewelery pieces I do is it helps keeps small elements in place. Kinda like putting sand under a car tire on ice, it gives it some "traction".

Regards,
Duane

RobinE · Post by **RobinE** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 11:22 am

Thanks Judith and Duane

Brilliant solution - will try this as well.

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 12:43 pm

Judith and Duane,

Neat idea! I was wondering if black powder would work better than clear because of the lower melting temp. If glued properly it should not be visible. Comments?

Cheers,

Bob

Tony Serviente · Post by **Tony Serviente** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 1:51 pm

I've been tack fusing spectrum irid to irid for many years, with no pop offs. I fire to a temp that gives a gently rounded edge to the tacked decorative elements, but still shows the irid well. Too hight and the irid is absorbed, too low and the edges are sharp, and the tack is poor. I have a line based on face up tacks of irid to irid, and if pop offs were a problem, I would have heard about. I have only done this with Spectrum, and do not know if it will work as well with BE.

jolly · Post by **jolly** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 2:33 pm

I have read that BE uses stannous chloride to make irid and Spectrum uses thermoluster, which would explain the different results.- Jolly

RobinE · Post by **RobinE** » Wed Jan 21, 2004 10:51 am

OK - I am getting some "pulling/alligator skin" sometimes around my tack fused pieces to irid. This doesn't happen anywhere else - just between tack fused elements that are spaced anywhere from 1/8" to 1/2" apart from eachother. And it isn't consistent with a color. I am doing this series in 6 diff colors.

Here's what I think:
- the tack fuse temp is too high or high/long
- I'm stacking and this tends to happen less on the glass that is on a lower shelf (my kiln is 13" deep)
- I will next try Judith's suggestion of glass tac/clear powder or fine under elements to be tack fused

Thoughts?

Thank you
Robin E

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Wed Jan 21, 2004 12:24 pm

Hi Robin,

What is the thickness of the base glass that you are tack fusing onto? If it is 1/8" then the glass may be contracting due to surface tension. The irid coating puckers as the glass contracts. If the base glass is 1/4" thick then it should not change volume ... in theory. I have never had what you describe for bases that were 1/4" thick.

The only other possibility is that you have a mix of hard and soft glasses and the slight differences in melting temperature is causing puckering... just another guess.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,

Bob

Debinsandiego · Post by **Debinsandiego** » Wed Jan 21, 2004 1:45 pm

The idea of the clear frit is pure genius. The problem is that the dicroic surface is â€œmetalâ€

RobinE · Post by **RobinE** » Wed Jan 21, 2004 10:02 pm

HI Bob:

Thanks for your thoughts. The blanks that are puckering have already been fired. They are 1/4". And the tack fused elements are a harder glass than the base 1/4" blanks.

I think I solved my problem today. We had moved my kiln from being outside into in the garage a few weeks ago. I readjusted my firing schedule and the todays batch came out great.

This stuff always keeps me on my toes.

Robin

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Tack Fusing on Irid Surface

Tack Fusing on Irid Surface

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