Hi,
We need to fix the lid of an old Evenheat 2451 kiln. It has been used a lot, though with care, by previous owner, so usual story, grooves on lid have widened and elements are sagging.
The bricks in the area where the handles in the front and the hinges in the back are located also need some fixing. We are also changing it to 3 phase. Since we are at it, would also like to give the lid bricks a sealing coat, to reduce/eliminate chances of brick dust falling on the glass.
The local Evenheat dealer suggested to use a thin wash of kiln cement and explained the process, this sounds fine to me.
Then found this product http://www.paragonweb.com/Liquid_Kiln_Coating.cfm. It specifically mentions that it is not kiln cement.
Wondering if anyone has used either, or found a better result with the Paragon coating? From reading posts here and looking at the Paragon website, I have gained respect for this company. The reason I have an Evenheat is that it was available locally, used, reasonably priced...a sort of miracle in my location.
The kiln cement I can get locally. The Paragon product I'll have to import. However, if it is better, lasts longer, or has any other noticeable benefits, I rather bring it in.
Was in any case thinking to get some of their Pyrolite adhesive to really secure the pins, so both can be posted together. Much prefer to do the job once with some certainty that it will last a long time.
It is very possible that there are answers to this in the old archive, but the link is no longer there (hopefully only temporarily).
Hope you won't mind helping out - most probably for the for the umpteenth time - with this query .
Many thanks, seachange
Paragon kiln coating or diluted kiln cement
Moderators: Brad Walker, Tony Smith
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Re: Paragon kiln coating or diluted kiln cement
Thank you for your kind message about Paragon. The thinned kiln cement will work as a lid coating, as your dealer told you. The Liquid Kiln Coating that we offer is a mixture of kiln cement, fine brick dust, a gumming agent, and water. Here are instructions for applying the coating to the lid:seachange wrote:The local Evenheat dealer suggested to use a thin wash of kiln cement and explained the process, this sounds fine to me.
Then found this product http://www.paragonweb.com/Liquid_Kiln_Coating.cfm. It specifically mentions that it is not kiln cement.
Wondering if anyone has used either, or found a better result with the Paragon coating? From reading posts here and looking at the Paragon website, I have gained respect for this company. The reason I have an Evenheat is that it was available locally, used, reasonably priced...a sort of miracle in my location.
The kiln cement I can get locally. The Paragon product I'll have to import. However, if it is better, lasts longer, or has any other noticeable benefits, I rather bring it in.
http://www.paragonweb.com/Kiln_Pointer.cfm?PID=212
Sincerely,
Arnold Howard
Paragon Industries, L.P., Mesquite, Texas USA
ahoward@paragonweb.com / http://www.paragonweb.com
Re: Paragon kiln coating or diluted kiln cement
Thanks Arnold, had another query, have sent you a private email.
it seems no one has a comparison test...had to try my luck .
I imagine comparing would be difficult, considering all the variables in kiln use, plus those in kiln construction.
In case it helps anyone, in our self built kiln we ended up placing a stainless steel plate between the brick and the coils. These are wound around ceramic tubes, there was just space enough to fit the plate and bolt it to the bricks. There has to be enough clearance and has to be well secured so there is no chance of contact with the coils, ever.
We recommended the same solution to a friend who has a very old ceramic kiln. No elements on the lid, but the whole structure was coming loose. Often it is possible to simply replace the bricks, but here she would have had to buy a whole pallet, plus transport. The plate was cheap, quick to do and solved the problem.
Noticed in my kiln that after a long time the plate is creating some very fine black dust. Must be happening after the kiln has cooled down, since it is never on the glass, only on the shelf if I leave it in the kiln for a while.
Thanks and best regards, seachange
it seems no one has a comparison test...had to try my luck .
I imagine comparing would be difficult, considering all the variables in kiln use, plus those in kiln construction.
In case it helps anyone, in our self built kiln we ended up placing a stainless steel plate between the brick and the coils. These are wound around ceramic tubes, there was just space enough to fit the plate and bolt it to the bricks. There has to be enough clearance and has to be well secured so there is no chance of contact with the coils, ever.
We recommended the same solution to a friend who has a very old ceramic kiln. No elements on the lid, but the whole structure was coming loose. Often it is possible to simply replace the bricks, but here she would have had to buy a whole pallet, plus transport. The plate was cheap, quick to do and solved the problem.
Noticed in my kiln that after a long time the plate is creating some very fine black dust. Must be happening after the kiln has cooled down, since it is never on the glass, only on the shelf if I leave it in the kiln for a while.
Thanks and best regards, seachange
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Re: Paragon kiln coating or diluted kiln cement
What grade of stainless did you use? Some cheaper (?) tends to spall. What gauge sheet?seachange wrote:In case it helps anyone, in our self built kiln we ended up placing a stainless steel plate between the brick and the coils. These are wound around ceramic tubes, there was just space enough to fit the plate and bolt it to the bricks. There has to be enough clearance and has to be well secured so there is no chance of contact with the coils, ever.
We recommended the same solution to a friend who has a very old ceramic kiln. No elements on the lid, but the whole structure was coming loose. Often it is possible to simply replace the bricks, but here she would have had to buy a whole pallet, plus transport. The plate was cheap, quick to do and solved the problem.
Noticed in my kiln that after a long time the plate is creating some very fine black dust. Must be happening after the kiln has cooled down, since it is never on the glass, only on the shelf if I leave it in the kiln for a while.
Thanks and best regards, seachange
Jim
"With or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil—that takes religion. " Steven Weinberg
Re: Paragon kiln coating or diluted kiln cement
Hi Jim
we used stainless steel 316, 2mm thick.
It has been there now for about 18 months. Have just started noticing the fine dust, but as mentioned above, it does not affect the glass at all.
Best regards, seachange
we used stainless steel 316, 2mm thick.
It has been there now for about 18 months. Have just started noticing the fine dust, but as mentioned above, it does not affect the glass at all.
Best regards, seachange
Re: Paragon kiln coating or kiln cement OR SOMETHING ELSE
Hi Everyone,seachange wrote: In case it helps anyone, in our self built kiln we ended up placing a stainless steel plate between the brick and the coils. These are wound around ceramic tubes, there was just space enough to fit the plate and bolt it to the bricks. There has to be enough clearance and has to be well secured so there is no chance of contact with the coils, ever.
We recommended the same solution to a friend who has a very old ceramic kiln. No elements on the lid, but the whole structure was coming loose. Often it is possible to simply replace the bricks, but here she would have had to buy a whole pallet, plus transport. The plate was cheap, quick to do and solved the problem.
Noticed in my kiln that after a long time the plate is creating some very fine black dust. Must be happening after the kiln has cooled down, since it is never on the glass, only on the shelf if I leave it in the kiln for a while.
Thanks and best regards, seachange
I am SO frustrated.... I am getting kiln dust falling on my hard work thereby ruining it... I have a Paragon Janus Ovation 10 glass fusing kiln. I realize that I can't do combing/manipulation in it as it stresses the kiln brick in the lid too much due to the shock of cold air - So I just bought a Paragon fusion 10 with a fiber lid for that purpose....
I have been vacuuming the lid before each firing faithfully. Still dust... Since then I've used kiln cement to fix cracks and also used the thin coating (then wiped off in a hearty fashion) of Paragon Kiln coat - as per video instructions on-line. I STILL have kiln dust ruining my pieces. I am looking for a different, permanent solution to my problem.
Is it possible for me to install a stainless steel plate just below the elements and kiln brick in the lid??? I would hope that this would catch the falling dust... Or, can I cut fiber the size of the fire brick and attached it somehow to the brick to catch the dust? Any other ideas?
Thanks In Advance,
Ginny