Critiques

[Barbara Muth]

Brock brought this important question up in the "Thoughtful work" thread started by Catherine. I thought the question deserves some reflection apart from the "artist/voice" question.

. . .But also be sure you ask someone you know has the skills and ability to provide you with a valid critique to teach you through the process. . .

Who would that be? Brock

To whom do I address my requests for critique?

For many of us, our community of artists is here, online. People post images of their work for different reasons, and probably don't get the kind of response they are looking for. It is hard to "read" someone's request for feedback in the ethernet - do they want praise, encouragement, or honest critique? The flip side of that is that critique given online without any visual or physical stimulation (pat on the back, smiles, etc) can be difficult to receive. My experience is that online communication is often lacking in emotional content and thus more easily open to misinterpretetation/projections.

When I have encountered critique sessions at the end of a class they have usually been lacking in the depth I look for, focussing on technique rather than content. Critique of technique is important, especially in classes that teach technique. But when we move beyond acquiring techniques and begin to work at developing our "voice", critique of content becomes increasingly important.

As an aspiring artist I believe critique is an important part of my growth. Critique is hard to find where I am, and I live in an area full of glass artists. Some that I have asked for critique have been reluctant to offer it. Others I would not ask because I would not trust that they could be honest, or that they would have the capacity to critique.

I think it is just as difficult to find someone online to critique my work. I am reluctant to offer work up for critique in an open forum because I don't trust that I would get the hard appraisal I am looking for. I think trust is important. If I don't trust you to be honest with me and if I don't trust in your ability to critique my work, I won't benefit from your appraisal of my work.

On the other hand, if I am able to discern who would be competent at critiquing, I am reluctant to "pester" people I do trust by sending them images and requests for critiques. Maybe I am projecting, but I am sure there are many posters and lurkers who aspire to growth but are not quite sure how to ask, nor whom to ask, for the personal attention a critique requires.

What do y'all think?

Barbara

[Brock]

Brock brought this important question up in the "Thoughtful work" thread started by Catherine. I thought the question deserves some reflection apart from the "artist/voice" question.

. . .But also be sure you ask someone you know has the skills and ability to provide you with a valid critique to teach you through the process. . .

Who would that be? Brock

To whom do I address my requests for critique?

For many of us, our community of artists is here, online. People post images of their work for different reasons, and probably don't get the kind of response they are looking for. It is hard to "read" someone's request for feedback in the ethernet - do they want praise, encouragement, or honest critique? The flip side of that is that critique given online without any visual or physical stimulation (pat on the back, smiles, etc) can be difficult to receive. My experience is that online communication is often lacking in emotional content and thus more easily open to misinterpretetation/projections.

When I have encountered critique sessions at the end of a class they have usually been lacking in the depth I look for, focussing on technique rather than content. Critique of technique is important, especially in classes that teach technique. But when we move beyond acquiring techniques and begin to work at developing our "voice", critique of content becomes increasingly important.

I think that in most class situations, content is lacking because of an unfamiliarity with the new technique or process being taught, or there is just not enough time to make a piece with any content. Most often, in a comprehensive course, it's a monkey see-monkey do situation just to get the technique or process across.

As an aspiring artist I believe critique is an important part of my growth. Critique is hard to find where I am, and I live in an area full of glass artists. Some that I have asked for critique have been reluctant to offer it. Others I would not ask because I would not trust that they could be honest, or that they would have the capacity to critique.

As an interesting aside, most of our courses sell out. The few that haven't have scared off, we believe, students by the use of words like drawing and designing. This view is shared by a prominent teaching studio owner


I think it is just as difficult to find someone online to critique my work. I am reluctant to offer work up for critique in an open forum because I don't trust that I would get the hard appraisal I am looking for. I think trust is important. If I don't trust you to be honest with me and if I don't trust in your ability to critique my work, I won't benefit from your appraisal of my work.

On the other hand, if I am able to discern who would be competent at critiquing, I am reluctant to "pester" people I do trust by sending them images and requests for critiques. Maybe I am projecting, but I am sure there are many posters and lurkers who aspire to growth but are not quite sure how to ask, nor whom to ask, for the personal attention a critique requires.

What do y'all think?

I think you should ask people whom you trust and whose work you like to offer this service. Many of us are doing it already. Brock

[charlie]

I think you should ask people whom you trust and whose work you like to offer this service. Many of us are doing it already. Brock

but how do newbies find the initial set of people to trust? there's a lot of people who don't have access to, or knowledge of the people at, local colleges, art galleries, etc who may have the knowledge set to do real critiques, but again, how does one know who to trust? ask to see their resume?

[Brock]

Well . . . go into everyones profile . . . go to their web site . . . check their work . . . if you like it, ask them if they would critique your work.

[Cynthia]

...To whom do I address my requests for critique?

For many of us, our community of artists is here, online. People post images of their work for different reasons, and probably don't get the kind of response they are looking for. It is hard to "read" someone's request for feedback in the ethernet - do they want praise, encouragement, or honest critique? The flip side of that is that critique given online without any visual or physical stimulation (pat on the back, smiles, etc) can be difficult to receive. My experience is that online communication is often lacking in emotional content and thus more easily open to misinterpretetation/projections.

When I have encountered critique sessions at the end of a class they have usually been lacking in the depth I look for, focussing on technique rather than content. Critique of technique is important, especially in classes that teach technique. But when we move beyond acquiring techniques and begin to work at developing our "voice", critique of content becomes increasingly important.

As an aspiring artist I believe critique is an important part of my growth. Critique is hard to find where I am, and I live in an area full of glass artists. Some that I have asked for critique have been reluctant to offer it. Others I would not ask because I would not trust that they could be honest, or that they would have the capacity to critique.

I think it is just as difficult to find someone online to critique my work. I am reluctant to offer work up for critique in an open forum because I don't trust that I would get the hard appraisal I am looking for. I think trust is important. If I don't trust you to be honest with me and if I don't trust in your ability to critique my work, I won't benefit from your appraisal of my work.

On the other hand, if I am able to discern who would be competent at critiquing, I am reluctant to "pester" people I do trust by sending them images and requests for critiques. Maybe I am projecting, but I am sure there are many posters and lurkers who aspire to growth but are not quite sure how to ask, nor whom to ask, for the personal attention a critique requires.

What do y'all think?

Barbara

You probably aren't going to get a critique in a techniques class. Some of the glass folks out there that are teaching offer this next step in corse work devoted to giving you guidance concerning your imagery. This is in the form of critique and guided work while you develop your artistic direction. I know Roger Thomas is doing this and I hear that Steve Klein does this as well. Ask around to see who has had experiences with others in the realm of a real critique session. Your crit doesn't have to come from a glass worker unless you are seeking some technical answers...any visual artist can discuss your work with you if your concern is the imagery, composition and content. Do some digging to see who you think might be able to give you what you are looking for.

There's no harm in asking for a crit. The person you ask might decline, and nothing is lost. You have a valid point though Barbara, that without the benefit of face to face discussion, and the opportunity for the critic to actually see the work...a crit can potentially not go well. Electronic conversations are hard to make into a dialog and a valuable critique is partly about dialog and questions. Visual imagery has a structure it can follow just like the written word. Once you know the rules of the structure, then you get to break them as Amy in Milwaukee said. Those rules aren't that hard to learn...just like diagramming a sentence.

Someone is going to be willing and able to use their red pencil and mark up your margins.


Hope that is encouraging news for you.

[Barbara Muth]

Perhaps I came across as whining. I don't expect to have content critiqued in classes where we learn technique.

I think I was trying to express what may be a void for some people. Particularly those who have not taken classes and are working in their own corners, finding a resource for critiqueing may be difficult. It may be intimidating to ask someone you don't know, have never met, for a critique of your work.

Barbara

[Davidknox]

Barbara,

I just wrote this incredibly long reply to the critique issue from Catherine's string and got an error message that said "invalid session" when I went to send it. To summarize my otherwise brilliant and clever comments-

I don't know why I would want a technical critique of my work. I can see where it is technically lacking every time I look at a glass magazine, web-site, discard bin at the local fusing store, my next thought, etc. I also find that those same glass journals often applaude works that I find lifeless, dull and meaningless- buit that are technically exceptional. This evokes in me feelings of "what a waste." I know to play my soul on a particular instrument, I need to learn to play that instrument well enough to have it come through. That does not mean I want that instrument to sound "like that instrument is supposed to sound". That also does not mean I don't constantly look to improve and read feverishly every book on glass, kilns, enamels, ceramics, tooling, molds, etc i can- but not at the cost of my own experiments in terms of time.

A good friend of mine is a successful stained glass artist who produces meaningful, deep, complex pieces. He told me he no longer hangs out with the stained glass community because it seemed that when he showed them his work, they would criticize his solder joints or some other technical nuance and not even notice the incredible geometric forms he created. They saw the trees, not the forest. What his work evoked in them were feelings of disgust at his less than perfect solder work. It's not like his domes and doorways are crashing all over the US.


Allowing me to badley misquote - I believe it was the music critic for the NY Times who commented upon the release of Bob Dylan's first album
"Mr. Dylan as a musician is to music what a house painter is to the art of painting." I would say the Bob would probably only have replied with "I ain't goin work on Maggie's farm no more". I also don't think that Bob Dylan's technical improvement in playing the guitar or singing made much impact on the meaning or acceptance or rejection of his work. Anyone who really cared about that had already missed the point.

Now, whether I want to see if someone else finds something I did interesting or evokes in them feelings- whatever they may be- that is different. Or simply just finds the effects trippy- like my green, swampy glass-cool. I am also very pleased when I can create something I absolutely visually hate- but my customer completely loves- because I did it for them, not me. They wouldn't have liked what I loved and I was able to get out of the way and let my soul do it for them. It is as equally beautiful as it is tasteless- to me.

I gotta get back to work. This board is like a nice opium den to my ego.

By the way- the opinions I express herein are not necessarily those of the management.

Warmest Regards, David Knox